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Hot Coffee Cooling Off

Zonk posted more than 9 years ago | from the can-i-get-back-to-kirby-please dept.

Games 559

The storm of media and cynicism that was "Hot Coffee" is, thankfully, coming to an end. To wrap things up, reactions were mixed to the re-rating of GTA. Some thought it too much, some too little too late. With the removal of the M rating, ESRB president Patricia Vance considers the matter closed. Even those in the industry itself seem glad that it's over, though the folks quoted for the 1up story seem cynical about the whole thing. "[Rockstar] TOTALLY screwed the modding community, as far as I am concerned. Because they could have just removed the content. They tried to get cute and leave it in. In my experience that sort of thing is always deliberate. Anyway, the point is that most game developers are recalcitrant and immature jerks. When mom tells us we can't do something, we're sure as hell going to do it. If you get my meaning. I think 'mom' in this case was the ESRB." As a sidenote, stock in Take-Two Entertainment dropped by almost five percent at close of market today, on the news that even Gamestop is dumping the now AO-rated GTA title.

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Tshirt Already? (5, Informative)

ack154 (591432) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134597)

And as a keepsake for all of the madness... be sure to pick up your very own Hot Coffee [thinkgeek.com] t-shirt from ThinkGeek!

As soon as they're actually in stock, that is.

When you have a game like that (2, Funny)

GuitarNeophyte (636993) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134682)

When you have a game that features things that the majority of people have always wanted to do at some time or another, but didn't want to go to jail for it or they just didn't want to hurt people in real life, it doesn't matter what the rating it, it'll always sell like crazy.

Oh, and if you can jump out of a car, and let it keep going and run over gangstas and drug lords.

It won't hurt it.

Might even raise the sales of it, truth be told.

Luke
----
Like computers, but are frustrated about explaining things hundreds of times over? Send them to ChristianNerds.com [christiannerds.com]

Re:When you have a game like that (3, Funny)

bedroll (806612) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134727)

When you have a game that features things that the majority of people have always wanted to do at some time or another

I've always wanted to do a polygonal woman, they're just hard to find outside of gaming.

Re:When you have a game like that (2)

th3space (531154) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134805)

Personally, this whole HotCoffee row has bred in me a renewed interest in playing GTA:SA, as well as GTA:VC and GTAIII. You know what my favorite part is? Having sex with the hookers...and then killing them. (ps - not trolling, being dead on serious here)

Re:When you have a game like that (5, Interesting)

ipfwadm (12995) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134873)

My favorite thing to do in GTAIII was sit up in the parking garage (that way the helicopters couldn't get you) and shoot people in the head with the sniper rifle. My roommate enjoyed doing that so much I eyed him suspiciously him when the DC sniper stuff started.

Re:Tshirt Already? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134709)

It was just Rockstar's PR-stunt-attempt ("omg, look what an independent group of developers not at all affiliated with us, no, no, no really not, has found out lol! really, it is not us who published this to get media- and slashdot-coverage!") gone wrong.

Newbies.

Re:Tshirt Already? (1)

jtshaw (398319) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134712)

Thinkgeek also sells USB powered coffee mug sized heat plates to make sure you Hot Coffee stays good and hot for as long as you want it to.

It's about time! (4, Insightful)

ChibiLZ (697816) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134598)

I for one am very glad that this whole debacle is over. I think it's somewhat ridiculous that people are angry at Rockstar. AFAIK, GTA:SA is rated M for violence and sexual content. Why must it be AO now? This certainly wasn't hardcore porno, it was not even as bad as what you see on cable late at night.

And to think that GameStop is not going to sell the game anymore? Regardless, it's well out of the spotlight now, but the game they stop selling today is the game that they were hyping the hell out of for pre-orders 1 year ago. I don't care what the ESRB rating is, nothing has changed.

I certainly don't think kids should buy this game, regardless of the sex, they shouldn't be exposed to that kind of violent content. However, it's now a pain in the ass for me if I want to buy a copy. It seems I can no longer go into my local videogame store and pick it up, I'll have to order it online and wait. I wonder if it will arrive in a plain brown envelope. Wouldn't want the neighbors or mailman to know I'm getting such perverted things in the mail.

Re:It's about time! (2, Interesting)

Araxen (561411) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134638)

EB Games is still going to carry the game. They have only taken it off the self for about a week to make sure the boxes say AO on them. EB will make a killing now if they are the only brick and mortar place selling it.

Re:It's about time! (3, Insightful)

timeOday (582209) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134672)

I think it's somewhat ridiculous that people are angry at Rockstar. AFAIK, GTA:SA is rated M for violence and sexual content. Why must it be AO now?
When you decieve somebody, their reaction when the truth comes out is greater than if you had told them the same thing upfront.

What annoys people about this is that Rockstar decieved both the industry and the public about the content of the game. So long as this occurs, consumers can't know what they're buying. OK, so you don't mind. But the point is people should have the information up front to make their own choice.

Re:It's about time! (5, Insightful)

ipfwadm (12995) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134768)

What annoys people about this is that Rockstar decieved both the industry and the public about the content of the game. So long as this occurs, consumers can't know what they're buying.

No, Rockstar didn't deceive anyone. When you went out and bought the game, there was no possible way that you were going to get exposed to this "sex scene" without knowingly going out of your way to enable it. No possible way. Therefore, the sex scene was not part of the "content of the game", and therefore Rockstar did not deceive anyone about the content of the game.

People's reaction to this is "greater than if you had told them the same thing upfront" because they don't understand what it's all about. They hear that there's a sex scene in the game and they pull out their pitchforks and torches. They probably think this is actually a scene you'd come across during normal gameplay, and therefore they do feel deceived.

Re:It's about time! (1)

Radish03 (248960) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134695)

What I find the funniest about this is that to access the scenes, you need to go online and download a mod. And we all know the internet is entirely cotton candy and butterflies. If a kid has internet access and can get this mod, he sure as hell can access much worse than an animated blowjob with a simple google search.

Re:It's about time! (1)

BewireNomali (618969) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134798)

I agree, and will try and take it further.

Isn't this game a bit past its prime already as a retail commodity?

Like all things retail, the youngest consumer tends to the be the impulse buyer, which in this case means that the audience most affected by this ratings change would have purchased their game already.

<conspiracy theory> It could be interesting to see if there's a spike in the sales pattern after this *free publicity* scandal involving the ESRB and Rockstar. If the target audience in general for games is the adult gamer, this could be the kind of press to motivate the adult buyer into making a purchase if he hasn't done so. </conspiracy theory>

I feel like Rockstar walks away unscathed in this whole deal. They just stand to make more cash from the free press.

Re:It's about time! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134872)

"I feel like Rockstar walks away unscathed in this whole deal"

You're joking right? A 5% drop in stock price in a single day... I would hardly call that unscathed

Re:It's about time! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134827)

Please show me a late night cable show that has a fully naked chick suck some guy's dick. I'm quite serious, as this intrigues me.

While supplies last (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134599)

Get it while you still can. [amazon.com]

This game is going to be a mark in gaming history...

Re:While supplies last (1)

JavaLord (680960) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134629)

That is the funny part, I didn't buy it the last time because I I didnt like vice city very much. I'll probably have to go buy this one just to see what the fuss is about.

Re:While supplies last (1)

swissfondue (819240) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134791)

Free publicity. How often do US senators give air time to a game? How many kids are now asking their older siblings "please, can you get a copy for me?" Great marketing move.

Re:While supplies last (1)

sqlrob (173498) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134643)

Notice there's no "Add to cart" button (but there is an "add to baby registry").

I added it to my cart the night the AO changed, and kept it in saved items. The next day, "Move to cart" didn't work.

So, no, it's too late for getting it at Amazon.

Re:While supplies last (1)

evil-osm (203438) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134751)

Exactly!

So their stocks went down 5%, whoop de doo, they are making cash hand over fist with all this PR for this game, just think of all the people teetering as on wether or not to buy the game, then all this excitement comes out about it, possible fear that they may remove the game from store shelves.... I bet the game sold like crazy.

Re:While supplies last (1)

maotx (765127) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134830)

While Amazon may not be offering it anymore, eBay has it going [ebay.com] for $71 USD at the moment...

I hate America (4, Insightful)

Mr.Dippy (613292) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134603)

Let's see the game is about black men running around smacking hoes and doing drive bys and most people don't have a problem with this. But, once you add some sex into the game there are congressional hearings. Stupid America, when will you ever learn?!

Re:I hate America (5, Insightful)

Ced_Ex (789138) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134624)

I wouldn't say America, more like those stuck up Holier-Than-Thou retards at the ratings board.

I can't see how sex is more evil than violence. Think of the utopia they want to have. A world with violence and no sex. Wait... wouldn't that be the fuckin apocalypse?

Re:I hate America (1)

macshit (157376) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134782)

I have a feeling it's more like "those craven tools at the ratings board who will bend over and scream `harder!' before any politician who is trying to boost his sagging popularity ratings among the drooling mouth-breathers that form his electorate".

I'm moving to neptune.

AND AMERICA HATES YUO, COCKSOCKET (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134628)


Re:I hate America (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134636)

You didn't have a problem when it was white guys running around smacking hoes and killing people. When will you learn?

Re:I hate America (1)

garcia (6573) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134696)

But, once you add some sex into the game there are congressional hearings. Stupid America, when will you ever learn?!

I was having this discussion last night... America obviously didn't learn when we ended legal rascism during the 1960s because we are now trying to legally stop insurance coverage for homosexual couples.

Not only didn't the government learn but the American public didn't either.

It's really sad.

Re:I hate America (1)

operagost (62405) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134850)

What does this have to do with GTA:SA, again?

Remind me why R* should care again (3, Insightful)

BlackCobra43 (596714) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134605)

GTA: SA was the best-selling console game of 2004, despite only being published on one platform at the time. Are we seriously expected to believe major retailers will forever keep the evil, evil GTA games off their shelves? Why should Rockstar Games/Take Two?

Re:Remind me why R* should care again (4, Interesting)

blueZhift (652272) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134765)

In the short term, this whole deal seems to have backfired on Rockstar and they'll have to spend some money recalling shipped stock and then manufacturing and shipping the "clean" version. LOL, now mom and dad can safely buy GTA for junior and his 5th grade buddies! They should pick up the clean copies of 50cent's new album while they're at it.

Seriously though, Rockstar can still turn this into a New Coke style winner. Now they've essentially been given the green light to sell two versions of GTA: SA. They can sell the safe clean version at Wal-Mart and the uncut, girls gone wild, hentai version online. See now, they can just unlock the Hot Coffee minigames and add more if they want. With the AO label, they can totally cut loose and with all of the free publicity the market is already primed. It's almost as if they get to do the launch all over again. The only ones who could stop them from doing this might be Sony and Microsoft on the consoles since they have to be licensed to publish on those platforms. On the PC though, anything goes. Played right, R* may have opened the door a bit for AO versions of popular games to start appearing on consoles. As for the ESRB and modders everywhere, I think they've just been played...

Re:Remind me why R* should care again (1)

Nytewynd (829901) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134820)

You have it completely backwards. If the game originally got rated AO, it would not have been the best-selling console game of 2004. Most major stores don't carry AO games (Walmart, Amazon, etc).

The argument is not over the content at all. It is about the deliberate bypass of the rating system. I am one of the many people that don't see a pair of boobies as the end of world, especially in a game about car-jackings. Rockstar profited by allowing their game in more stores. The fact that this content was left on the disc pretty much proves that Rockstar intended this all along.

but i'm sales are going back up (1)

talaski23 (203277) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134609)

As a sidenote, stock in Take-Two Entertainment dropped by almost five percent at close of market today, on the news that even Gamestop is dumping the now AO-rated GTA title.
even though the game has already seen it's peak as far as sales are concerned, when it comes to pop-culture and console gaming is there any such thing as bad press?

Even Gamestop? (2, Informative)

sqlrob (173498) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134613)

I tried to get it there the day the rating changed. Nope, no way, not on any of the platforms, they don't sell AO.

And they still had the "San Andreas: Get It Here!" display up too.

So they were one of the *first* to can it, no "even GameStop" about it, they were the leaders of the pack.

more popular now... (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134617)

Teenagers want this game more than ever now. The stock price may drop but take a look at their sales results when they come out...

Re:more popular now... (1)

Trigun (685027) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134717)

People are dumping because they're afraid that the company will get riddled with civil suits. I can't wait to see the class-action lawsuit commercials.

Re:more popular now... (1)

Detritus (11846) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134864)

On what basis? I can't think of anything that would be the legitimate basis for a lawsuit.

Taking care of the problem (1)

Oceanplexian (807998) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134627)

Dupes have been eliminated thanks to new and amazing patented Slashdot story recycling capabilities.

Were we ever really surprised? (5, Interesting)

bedroll (806612) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134635)

I mean, the people who hated this game from before it was released were the same ones who made a stink of it this time. It was just a new angle to come at it. The realists say that the game was already rated M, which should've been good enough. The extremists think it should pulled from all shelves, AO isn't good enough.

I'm just waiting for the lawsuits. I'm sure that some offended conservative group is trying to find distress Moms who's little babies downloaded the patch to modify the game and were sullied. Poor little Johnny.

I for one... (4, Funny)

Phu5ion (838043) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134644)

am going out to purchase this too-hot-for-Gamespot game. Then i'm going to make little kids play it. Call me The Pusher Man.

the niche community (1)

CupBeEmpty (720791) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134646)

I think the most hilarious aspect of this whole thing is the incredibly niche audience that might actually get this mod. The gaming community while large is still only the people with enough money to spend on a decent computer, enough money to shell out ~$50 for a game, and enough time and nerdliness ot find "Hot Coffee" and set it up. The media frenzy around this has only served o make more people interested. I must say I have a decent system and spend the occasional $50 on the hottest new games, but I probably never would have heard about this unless I saw Senator Clinton making it her personal crusade.

I'm really puzzled (1, Insightful)

Arthur B. (806360) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134648)

On the one hand, in the USA, you can easily buy a rifle or a machine-gun with ammunitions. On the other hand you can't see consensual sex in a video game ? Urrr.

Re:I'm really puzzled (5, Funny)

tgd (2822) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134673)

How do you know it was consensual?

I think the programmers made them do it!

Re:I'm really puzzled (0, Redundant)

aliens (90441) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134719)

Bravo, bravo!

*Golf clap*

Very amusing low UID man.

Re:I'm really puzzled (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134749)

On the one hand, in the USA, you can easily buy a rifle or a machine-gun with ammunitions. On the other hand you can't see consensual sex in a video game ? Urrr.

Wow, the "I hate America" crowd is all over this story. Let me point out a few things to you:

1. It isn't easy to get a 'machine gun', afaik most automatic weapons are illegal. Even if you manage to buy a weapon in populated states (ie the northeast) you can't carry it anywhere.

Keep in mind, the US has a more 'liberal' policy twards guns because American citizens have a right to bear arms, it came second in the bill of rights only to free speech for a reason.

The groups that call themselves liberal in America today, are nothing of the sort, they are closet communists. The closest thing to a liberal today are the libertarians...but I'm straying off topic..

2. Video games are still considered 'kids games' here, and Americans go out of their way not to expose children to sexual content. It's likely a cultural thing but in this glorious age of 'multiculturalism' shouldn't ours be respected?

3. I don't think most parents realize the amount of violence in Video games. The generation of parents now, are fairly awful and rely on things such as daycare to raise their children rather than a family. We've managed to convince our women that it's better to work than to raise a family, which works out nicely for corprate America, but totally screws a generation of kids out of being parented correctly.

Re:I'm really puzzled (0, Redundant)

Arthur B. (806360) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134810)

I don't hate America (USA) at all. As a matter of fact I am even moving there next September. My point is, it is strange to be so liberal with guns, and so puritan with alcohol, sex etc.

Re:I'm really puzzled (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134835)

As a matter of fact I am even moving there next September

Don't forget to keep your door locked and buy a gun.

Re:I'm really puzzled (off topic) (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134822)

No, I am not trying to have an argument. I have just never seen the viewpoint that non libertian liberal Americans are closet communists. If you are willing then please share your view. I promise I won't flame, even though I don't think I will agree. I am honestly interested in your differing opinion. I can't promise there won't be other trolls though.

Re:I'm really puzzled (1)

Detritus (11846) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134762)

You can't easily buy a machine gun. It requires a background investigation, fingerprints, a bunch of paperwork, and the signature of a local law enforcement official. Even then, it may be prohibited by state or local law.

Re:I'm really puzzled (1)

wannabe (90895) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134783)

And then look at the price + a $200 tax just for the transfer. And it can't be newer than 1986.

Re:I'm really puzzled (1)

CardiganKiller (854899) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134771)

Make that polygonal sex with one partner fully clothed. What percentage of kids have had a sexual experience with the opposite of sex by the age of 17? I'd be willing to throw in a 80-90%. Now don't everybody chime in at once about how my figures are grossly exaggerated, this IS slashdot... don't mix up statistics with your own personal history.

It was about deceit (2, Insightful)

Shivetya (243324) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134831)

The sex part is being used by those trying to excuse the fact that they knowningly did something they were not supposed to. In other words they were trying to trivialize it by attempting to put the blame on the people who complained!

Just because your values or my values do not align themselves with others in no way makes ours superior.

Many of these programmers do act like jerks. Ever spent time dealing with MMORPG developers and you quickly find out there are many jerks and too many have god-complexes. When you point out things they should not do they quickly turn around attacking the person pointing out the issue instead of dealing with the issue.

Re:I'm really puzzled (3, Informative)

Rasta Prefect (250915) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134837)

On the one hand, in the USA, you can easily buy a rifle or a machine-gun with ammunitions.

Uhhh...No. A rifle? Yes. A machine gun? You can get one, provided a clear criminal record, but it's not exactly easy.

Thanks Zonk (1)

techguy911 (672069) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134649)

For including that immature and stupid rant about the article on the main Slashdot page. Don't we get enough of that here in the forums!

Good! (0, Troll)

91degrees (207121) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134650)

I think it was disgusting that this content was even considered, let alone included in the actual game!

My 12 year old son has this game, and he could easily have been affected by these scenes of depravity. I'll be taking it back to the shop as soon as possible and demanding they exchange it with a copy that is suitable for a child of his age.

Quick question (1)

BlackCobra43 (596714) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134668)

When exactly did buying a game rated "M" - for people of 17 years or older - seem like a good parenting decision to you?

Re:Good! (4, Insightful)

Angry Toad (314562) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134683)

I'll be taking it back to the shop as soon as possible and demanding they exchange it with a copy that is suitable for a child of his age.

Good idea. GTA is, with or without sexual content, utterly inapproriate for a 12 year old.

Re:Good! (0, Troll)

91degrees (207121) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134686)

Let me guess.

You're one of those people who considers Tom and Jerry excessively violent aren't you.

Re:Good! (1)

lmsig (110148) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134684)

Please please please tell me you just forgot the tags!

Re:Good! (0, Troll)

RockModeNick (617483) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134689)

What a troll this is - if you actually were to think the content in that game outside of this is MORE suitable to a child of his age, well, thats just sick man.

Re:Good! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134720)

Aren't you the parent? Do you know that the only way to get the content in question is to overtly download a patch?

Rather than demand the store replace your copy why don't you just be the Father here and tell your son not to do it?

BTW, what makes you think the game as originally sold is suitable for a 12 year old? I understand it contains nothing but violence - drive-by shootings, slapping ho's, killing cops. I think you are wrong for letting a 12 year old get the game without the sex.

Re:Good! (1)

91degrees (207121) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134761)

I think you are wrong for letting a 12 year old get the game without the sex.

You think it would be better to let him play the game with the sex?

Re:Good! (2, Insightful)

tolkienfan (892463) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134876)

With the sex and without the violence.

I'd rather my kids appreciate sex than violence.

Re:Good! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134769)

Umm, ok, if your precious little 12 year old is smart enough to GET and INSTALL the hack, then trust me, he has already seen plenty more graphic things than what's in this game. Oh and by the way, the content wasn't really "included in the actual game". in "the actual game" you just get to see a nice boring shot of the front of your girlfriend's house. What I find amusing is that you let your 12 year old have this game in the first place, when it was ALREADY rated M for MATURE, that's 17+, and last time I checked, 12 is less than 17, or are your math skills as bad as your parenting skills? I guess you don't care about your son running around shooting at cops and having gang wars and screwing prostitutes then killing them to get his money back... but no, as soon as somebody is having sex WITH THEIR GIRLFRIEND and, I might add, ALL THEIR CLOTHES ON, well that's just terrible then isn't it? Maybe you should sell your child on eBay to a REAL PARENT.

New Version (1)

kaellinn18 (707759) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134653)

Gamespy says Rockstar is also going to be making a new M rated version with the "evil" content content removed.

Source [gamespy.com] It's at the bottom of the article. Most of the meat of it is stuff that's been beaten to death over and over again.

Re:New Version (1)

Compass (557976) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134800)

Shouldn't they have done that from the start?

Or did they expect someone to find about this hidden feature, enable it and generate the noise?

Compass.

Hot hot hot (1)

ph4te (901242) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134656)

Hot hot hot! What temperature is this coffee? HOT HOT HOT! Is it cold? No! It's hot hot hot! I think Clinton burned herself with a decent sized community on this one. It really is pathetic to think that the US (in general) has absolutely no problem with wonton violence, drug use, and rampant criminal activity, but as soon as sex is mentioned they run to the fucking hills like a bomb went off. "Think of the children!" Wait a second, how the fuck did you get your kids if it wasn't for some nice mommy-daddy action somewhere. Come on Hilary, you can't possibly tell me you've never had a roll in the hay... or in the backseat of a car.

So.. (4, Interesting)

Turn-X Alphonse (789240) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134657)

So they add a new label and it's done with. It's the same game it was last week, the same game it was last month and the same game it'll be tomorrow.

GTA:SA will sell no matter the age rating, anyone who wanted it already had it or knows where to get it. It's like closing the stable door once the horse has bolted.

The "it's for the children" groups will see this as a victory. The game industry will shrug and go "oh well" and the gamers will go "STFU and get over it, it's a game".

That's how life works. Give it a month and they'll find another way to attack GTA, do very little (oh they changed a letter and added another to the rating GASP! Think of the ink it'll use!), rinse and repeat.

Maybe we should start pointing out how GTA:SA is infact a POSITIVE story about a guy trying to get out the ghetto and deal with corrupt officials with too much power.

Well... at least (4, Funny)

Adult film producer (866485) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134658)

I can still kill cops and pummel innocent bystanders with a club, smashing their brains in till blood oozes all over the sidewalk. Good family fun.

jackass (1)

Tebriel (192168) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134661)

"Anyway, the point is that most game developers are recalcitrant and immature jerks."

This was clearly the developers fault the whole way through.

Yeah, screw you pal.

Re:jackass (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134772)

Yeah I liked that quote too.

The guy's obviously just pissed that he wasn't recalcitrant and immature enough to come up with the billion-dollar GTA concept.

Maddox's take on Hot Coffee (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134665)

Be sure to check out Maddox's hilarious take [thebestpag...iverse.net] on Hot Coffee ... Cracked me up.

Publicity (2, Insightful)

MarkByers (770551) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134667)

Despite all the bad publicity about this game, I can only imagine that it will have a positive effect on sales, as loads of people that otherwise would never have bought this game are now interested in it, purely because of the amount of hype surrounding it.

"True" Fallout (1)

kinglink (195330) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134679)

The only thing that happened is that millions of more copies were sold because of the Hot Coffee mod, now the price for the "original" version of GTA:SA will start to sky rocket, and then they will release a new version near the end of this year.

Honestly GTA is a game that people desire over many others. I'm sure just in the first day of PC sales, it sold more then the entire run of some of those lesser games.

And the fact they are making a new edition means collectors who have all three versions will plunk down another 50 or so.

Honestly the only fallout from this thing is the few people who didn't buy the game yet but was going to, and the companies reputation is "Tarnished" (oh no, they were thinking of an EVEN MORE adult version of the game? I will never buy from them again.)

Of course the fact that the "Hot Coffee" stuff is the same maturity level as all the rest of the violence, murder and mayhem in the game isn't meantioned in any of those news reports I bet.

Re:"True" Fallout (3, Informative)

themishkin (898361) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134846)

I was going to buy this game in the end of August before college started up again. Instead, I'm going to go buy it today after work, not because I actually want the "Hot Coffee" mod, but I don't want a shitty version of the game. I have no idea how far Rockstar will go in "changing" the original release, and I prefer my games uncensored. As far as the AO stuff goes, I think the shower scene at the end of Tomb Raider 2 was much more enjoyable than this GTA:SA clip. (for those of you who finished the game without cheats) And, the graphics were about the same between these two games =D

Necrophilia (1)

Detritus (11846) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134697)

What rating would the game get if it included necrophilia? Obviously, game characters having sex with live characters is out, even though pulverizing them with a baseball bat is OK.

Re:Necrophilia (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134790)

Let's make a mod and find out!

An advantage to proprietary software (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134699)

The first time I tried to post this, I typed "An advantage to proprietary software" in the subject bar and hit 'enter'. FireFox immediately crashed. Hmm. I look down and see that the word image is 'restrain'. Hmm.

Anyway, if GTA was open source, it would be very difficult to kill Hot Coffee.

Coud AO be good for Take Two? (1)

Tibor the Hun (143056) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134701)

If they have an AO rating for a game, now they're free to experiment with some new adult games.
LS Larry was a decent shot, but this allows them to push the envelope further. (I know it wasn't a Take Two's game, but speaking in general...)

I think a market could use a decent game with adult elements in it.
I know I myself am a bit tired of "kiddified" games that are supposed to be serious and engaging.

Re:Coud AO be good for Take Two? (1)

sqlrob (173498) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134746)

AO's been out for a while, since the beginning of the ratings, TTBOMK.

There is an AO version of Leisure Suit Larry for the PC, in addition to the M rated ones.

I really don't understand how Larry got an M, even in the M rated version. The only reason it was worth playing was to see how far they were pushing the envelope.

Re:Coud AO be good for Take Two? (1)

Tibor the Hun (143056) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134785)

I know AO's been out for a while, but what I'm saying is that Take Two is now free to run with it.
They can say, well, we've already got one AO game, we might as well make another one and see how it sells. They don't have to worry about their image any more...

Apart from Japanese sex games (thank you Illusion) there are not really any Adult games out there. Not even independent ones.

The next step.... (1)

Jazu (215175) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134725)

I think we need a modder campaign to put sex in every game where it makes any sense at all from now on.

Re:The next step.... (1)

lurch_ss (865961) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134869)

To reach the most people, I say we start with Minesweeper and Solitaire.

In other news... (4, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134726)


This just in. "Real Life" has been re-rated AO by ESRB because it features the same violent and sexual content as GTA:SA.

Quote the leader: "We first noticed this when we found out there are a lot of people being invited for 'hot coffee' everywhere! This has to stop! We had no idea sex is available to everyone"

From now on, life is rated AO which means anybody under the magical age of 18 is no longer allowed to have a life.

The Sims (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134731)

There were hundreds of adult themed addons for the sims and the content of many of them was a lot more explicit than the Hot Coffee mod. It's ESRB Rating is T (Teen) and it is specifically designed for people to produce whatever addons they want. Considering The Sims franchise is just as famous, if not more than GTA, how come nobody cares?

The ESRB screwed themselves (2, Insightful)

AxemRed (755470) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134732)

According to their own criteria, the game should have been AO from the beginning. http://www.esrb.org/esrbratings_guide.asp [esrb.org] "Titles in this category may include prolonged scenes of intense violence and/or graphic sexual content and nudity." The whole game is a scene of intense violence.

Re:The ESRB screwed themselves (1)

Packet Pusher (231564) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134825)

The whole game isn't violent. I drive around on motorcycles a lot and try to jump stuff too :)

Who's Responsibility (2, Insightful)

kortex (590172) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134773)

This is just another example of a really messed up society. Through the years, things that are considered 'bad for kids' has constantly evolved and changed. There was a time that saying 'damn' on TV was completely taboo. Today I routinely hear much worse on broadcast (let's not even talk about cable!). Every generation has had it's gripes about what the kids during that time were watching, doing, playing and saying.

Unfortunately, there has yet to be a generation where the parents take reponsibility for educating and censoring (if necessary)the content available in their own homes. Parents that do take the time to take care of their own are not the ones screaming their heads off. People argue 'What about when my kids are not at home?!'. To that I say, educate your kids! I believe kids can be taught right from wrong. Nothing will keep children from doing 'bad' or seeing 'bad' things once in a while. This is a part of growing up and part of the learning process.

A Few Good Men (1)

bobzieruncle (812075) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134776)

Is the furor really over yet?

I'm waiting for the "A Few Good Men" Hot Coffee machinima version to come out. ;^)

EVEN those in the industry? Uhh... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134778)

"Even those in the industry itself seem glad that it's over"

This would imply that you think everyone in the industry that's been hit by a huge controversial shitstorm wanted it to go on for longer. .... English, people. English.

The biggest problem might not have been the sex. (3, Insightful)

Captain Sarcastic (109765) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134793)

The big problem wasn't that there was sex involved in GTA:SA. So you have ways of moving the pixels so that it looks like some guy is banging the hell out of some girl. Big deal.

The major problem was with the timeline:

  1. Rockstar tells the MSRB, "Yeah, OK, we have some adult-themed material in this game, but that's why we figure an M-rating to be about right, because there's nothing explicit in the game."
  2. Hot Coffee comes out, showing the sex, and Rockstar says "Those @#$%ing modders! They must have inserted that porn!"
  3. Rockstar comes out and says, "Well, OK, the modders didn't insert the porn - it was already in there, but no fair drawing adverse inferences!"

It wasn't so much the sex, but the lies that got people up in arms about Rockstar. (No videotape this time, at least) We don't like being made to look like fools, and so the ESRB lowered the boom on GTA:SA.

I, on the other hand, am willing to throw brickbats all of the involved parties:

  • Rockstar for lying about what content it did provide and for trying to blame the modders who exposed (pardon the expression) the hidden stuff;
  • The ESRB for having such a skewed viewpoint about the difference between "M" and "AO"
  • Above all, the parents who bought the game for Little Johnny and Janey who ignored the "M" rating and the criminal and violent subtext of the game, but were shocked, shocked! when sex reared its head.

A plague, not on one, not on both, but on all your houses!

Rating (1)

orkysoft (93727) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134794)

AFAIK, the game had been rated 18+ in The Netherlands all along. Gee, why would that be? Perhaps because of the extreme violence?

Hurricane in a teacup (4, Insightful)

AdamD1 (221690) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134814)

What baffles me the most is that M (for mature) is rated as being for customers "17 and older", while AO is for customers "18 and older." That's not a huge difference. One year. What does a 17 year old not know that an 18 year old is suddenly an expert at these days? Especially since I regularly get my ass handed to me by 16 years olds (or younger) on many online games, I fail to see how a rating system would make any sort of difference to a game like this. If I'm 16, I'll probably find the means to get this game one way or the other.

Also: there isn't any nudity in this game (not even, specifically, in the hot coffee segment where one would expect it.) It's quite obviously cartoonishly presented. I can understand the uproar over Manhunt, which is by comparison very detailed and brutally violent. But this is to my mind one of the most ridiculous "debacles" I've ever heard of. Anyone who assumes that a game named "Grand Theft Auto" is for teenagers is living in a fantasy world. Why it takes a sticker saying "AO" versus "M" to drive this home is beyond me. Does this mean I can make a game called "Assassinate The President" or "Serial Rapist" and expect the rating to determine whether Walmart will carry it or not?

And where are the freakin' parents? Out carjacking?

ad

It too bad... (1)

Jack Johnson (836341) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134828)

That the eunuch that assumptive quote is attributed to is an Anonymous Coward. I'd love to know who said it was and boycott their releases.

So, this whole thing in summary (4, Insightful)

mcc (14761) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134840)

  1. Anyone who previously thought that the ESRB was a good idea and defended it on the basis that if the industry self-regulated it would provide a bulwhark against censorship from outside has just been proven wrong.

    The ESRB has been demonstrated a tool for censorship from outside, as demonstrated by the fact that a game has just been effectively banned from sale in the U.S., by way of it being moved from M to AO, based on nothing but a targeted public smear campaign. The content even in the modded "AO" version of GTA:SA is significantly tamer than the sexual content that which is already present in a very large number of M games.
  2. Anyone within the Hillary Clinton / etc "blame video games" camp who previously claimed that they just cared about protecting "the children" has just been shown to be lying.

    This has been demonstrated by their extended attack on a game that was already "mature, 17 or older only, not to be sold to minors" with a "strong sexual content" label, an attack which apparently only ended with the effective banning of the game. Apparently these people don't care about children, they just care about either political self-promotion or imposing their morality on others, and children are just a tool to achieve this.

Why, Why, Why ... (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134853)

Hot Coffee Cooling Off

Being a fanatic religious and self-righteous hypocrite myself I wan't to urge everyone to sign a petition against video games with Hot Coffee. I haven't RTFA but Hot Coffee is bad. It murders the precious brains of our lovely children. I don't want to talk to my children when they play video games and educate them and parent them. I want to rant and whine for the love of God!!!

PERSPECTIVE People (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13134854)

This matter isn't over. Geezus, 1 day and people think it's winding down already. Here is what will happen:

1. Rockstar could sue the ESRB for making the decision they did.

2. The game is not now AO. It is now "UNRATED". Get it? Stores could still choose to sell it and it would NOT violate their anti-AO policies.

3. Rockstar will recompile the game without the sex content, re-submit for a rating, get their M back again, and then the game is back on store shelves.

What I find interesting is... (2, Interesting)

RamboIII (899894) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134860)

...that in the other games, back to GTAIII, you could ALWAYS have sex with a prostitute. You can pull the vehicle up and wait. The hooker walks up, talk to you a while, and then get in. After that you have to go find a place to "rock the vehicle", AND you get more life, so it's encouraged. How is this any different? I mean, nobody raised a stink about it at least.

AO should get the new content (5, Funny)

Fr05t (69968) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134865)

Hell if I'm going to buy an AO game I better be getting what is promised on the box!

Next weeks headline : "Geek sues Rockstar for false claims of explicit sex in GTA".

Quote from the article "Steve purchased GTA:SA hoping to get a glimpse of naked women engaged in sexual acts, but instead found himself searching Rockstar's website for a 'patch'. Turns out Rockstar didn't live up to their promise of hot sex and coffee - the only way to get to that content is from a program made by some Swedish guy who doesn't even work for the game developer."

After-market madness (1)

Audigy (552883) | more than 9 years ago | (#13134866)

The news stories may be cooling off, but the eBay madness [ebay.com] has just started to brew.

I can't believe people are considering this game "rare" even though literally millions of copies were printed. Oh well.
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