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Condemned 2 Trying to Avoid Manhunt 2's Fate 108

Posted by Zonk from the game-must-be-approved-by-state-comrade dept.
CVG is reporting that Monolith, makers of the upcoming Condemned 2, are working with the ESRB to avoid an AO rating. As we've discussed previously, an AO ban in the states is effectively a ban on retail sales. From the article: "When asked for examples of what we might now never see in a game again, we were told, 'An example of what we cut would be putting someone's head in a vice. That was too much, you know. There are also some decapitations we've lost. But this is more Sin City than it is real world and we want people to know that this is not a real world.'"
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Condemned 2 Trying to Avoid Manhunt 2's Fate More

Condemned 2 Trying to Avoid Manhunt 2's Fate

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  • Bah (Score:5, Insightful)

    by orclevegam ( 940336 ) on Thursday July 26, 2007 @04:51PM (#20002347) Journal
    I'd like to see a retailer grow some balls, tell the ESRB to shove off, and start carrying AO games on the shelves. I don't care if they section it off in it's own little area or something, so long as it's available for purchase. Then companies could make whatever they feel like making and who cares what the ESRB rates it.

    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by Loadmaster ( 720754 )
      The problem is Sony, MS and Nintendo will not allow AO games on their consoles. Gotta blame the ESRB and hardware companies for this crap.

      Swi
      • I know that MS and Nintendo have to sign off on a game prior to it being released for the console, but do you know if Sony does? It was my understanding that at least for the PS2, you could get a development kit and release a game without any approval from Sony (well, you had to buy the kit from them, but from then on it was all you), unless you wanted an official seal on your game. Also, any speculation on how everyone is going to be handling the new customer generated content? If I recall didn't Nintendo

        • If I recall didn't Nintendo recently announce they would be opening up a SDK for homebrew development of virtual console games?

          Wii Ware is not exactly homebrew in the sense of "go buy a DS and a Games 'n' Music card at Wal-Mart, download devkitARM, read through a tutorial, and you're set". You still have to have demonstrated your ability on some other platform (read "Windows or Mac" because all other platforms are lockout chipped). You still have to lease office space separate from a dwelling. You still have to present detailed plans for a specific title to Nintendo. And you still have to submit the final product to ESRB ($3000) a

        • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

          by 7Prime ( 871679 )
          Actually, it was Sony who spoke up first. Remember, Manhunt 2 was to be released on the Wii and PS3. Microsoft's a little more wishy-washy on the issue, but from what I've heard, it's only because they haven't really been forced into a possition like this before. All three of them have a strictly no-AO policy, however.

          • Re: (Score:1)

            by mink ( 266117 )
            "All three of them have a strictly no-AO policy, however."

            and that is the stupidest thing I have ever seen as a money making decision.
            I havent checked the 360 or PS3 but the Wii has parental locking available, problem solved IMO.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by LKM ( 227954 )
          During the last gen, Sony was the worst in censoring stuff. Just compare BMX XXX on the PS2 to the other versions.
      • alrighty then. how bouts they censor the console version and leave the PC version alone?

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by adona1 ( 1078711 )
          Another possibility - lock the 'adult' content on the console version (the way Duke Nukem 3D [wikipedia.org] was released in Australia) and have the gamer call in/log on and prove their age with a CC number or something along those lines to unlock the gore/sex/what have you. Not foolproof, but probably no worse than a kid getting their older brother to buy an AO game (if they could find one) or the store clerk not asking for ID.

          • Re: (Score:1)

            by dintech ( 998802 )
            Interesting comment. I think retrospectively the content in Duke Nukem 3D is pretty benign now. I think eventually people will see Manhunt 2 in the same light. What that says about human nature I don't know...
            • duke 3d had nudity it in. granted, it was CGI nudity, but i think the only thing that's advanced with the violence/offensiveness in games is the quality of graphics. other than that, i think games have actually become tamer.

              i still think mortal kombat was more violent than today's games. "bang, bang, you're dead" big deal. now scorpion breathing fire and incinerating his opponenents alive, that's action!

      • The problem is Sony, MS and Nintendo will not allow AO games on their consoles. Gotta blame the ESRB and hardware companies for this crap.

        I don't blame the ESRB. Their job is to rate games, and if they feel a game is worth an AO then they should rate it AO. As for the hardware companies, I can understand why they don't want to approve of an AO game, but there should be a way for games they don't like to be playable on the systems. It's not like Sony can prevent Pokémon DVDs from playing in Sony DVD players (though it is amusing that I have to play my Gamecube demo DVD in my PS2), so why should they prevent people from making games th

    • Agreed, but that isn't the biggest problem, the biggest problem is that you can't release an AO game for any of the consoles. Both console makers and retailers need to open up to AO games if they're going to make any headway.
    • I've been with you on that since the whole realization that AO games can't be bought in retail. Been.

      The ESRB was created as a stopgap by the industry to pull the rug out from those who saught government intervention in ratings and permissions. It's very much a "see? We can self-regulate so you don't have to!" Much like the PMRC did with the parental advisory stickers. The same thing was done by the MPAA a about 50 years ago due to movie content concerns, and comic book organizations, too. V-Chip? Yup. All

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by orclevegam ( 940336 )

        I understand the history behind the ESRB and why it exists, I just feel it's wrong for retailers to make blanket decisions to not stock a product based on its rating. I also think selling two versions of the product, one censored and the other not might be workable, so long as the censored version is clearly marked. I refuse to purchase any CDs at WalMart because they censor all their CDs, and it really ticks me off that they don't even put any warning stickers telling you they're censored.

        As for the MPAA,

        • I also think selling two versions of the product, one censored and the other not might be workable, so long as the censored version is clearly marked.

          The ESRB fee for a censored version and an uncensored version of the same title is no less than for two separate titles. And watch bugs get introduced between the uncensored version and the censored version.

          I refuse to purchase any CDs at WalMart because they censor all their CDs, and it really ticks me off that they don't even put any warning stickers telling you they're censored.

          Which Wal-Mart store do you shop at? In the Wal-Mart stores in Fort Wayne, Indiana, the price sticker on an edited music CD says "EDITED".

          • ---Which Wal-Mart store do you shop at? In the Wal-Mart stores in Fort Wayne, Indiana, the price sticker on an edited music CD says "EDITED".

            Ditto, but I'm in Columbus, IN. Both Mal-Warts have the EDITED stickers...

            Though I havent bought any new CD's in about 5 years. Thank goodness for Half-Price Books (medium small cheap book/cd/dvd store) in Indy and Greenwood. They even have LP's at the Greenwood store (on 31 south of county line).
        • So then your beef is with the retailers, not the ESRB or the MPAA or whatever. If Walmart decides not to sell AO games, that's their decision. The ESRB rates games according to how the games ought to be rated (if it doesn't that is another issue). So if you don't like the rating, then complain to the game developer. If you don't like that $RETAIL_OUTLET doesn't sell the game, then complain to $RETAIL_OUTLET. But this has nothing to do with the ESRB. If they just made it M so that the game could sell,

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Simon80 ( 874052 )

        I think the video game industry needs to learn what the MPAA and cable telecommunications giants have learned. Campaign contributions. Lobbyists. "Favors." You scratch my back we'll scratch yours.
        Sure, the video game industry obviously needs to just get with the program. It's not like the political system is broken or anything. Seriously, you'd actually prefer that the video game industry helps perpetuate corruption? I'm sure that would end well.
        • It IS broken, yes, but the video game industry isn't the one to change that. In the meantime they've got to protect themselves and buying congress is a pretty effective way to do it.

          Things like term limits and the electing of politicians that actually care about freedoms and liberties instead of their next campaigns' talking points is what's going to fix that problem. When personal freedoms are no longer trumped by the nanny state then dependance on broken political influence mechanism will no longer be req

      • Re: (Score:1)

        by mink ( 266117 )
        Don't forget the good ol' Comics Code Authority.

        From Wikipedia's highlights:
        * Crimes shall never be presented in such a way as to create sympathy for the criminal, to promote distrust of the forces of law and justice, or to inspire others with a desire to imitate criminals.
        * If crime is depicted it shall be as a sordid and unpleasant activity.
        * Criminals shall not be presented so as to be rendered glamorous or to occupy a

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by brkello ( 642429 )
      That's a moot point since the major console makers won't license games on their system that are AO only.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Taevin ( 850923 ) *
        Simple solution: Release a censored version for the consoles and release the original version for the PC.

        If the numbers show that the prudes are correct and these AO games are an evil that no moral person would subject themselves to, then no harm done and you've still made a profit on your game while still satisfying those hardcore gamers that want the AO version and are willing to pay for an expensive computer to run it.

        If, as I suspect, there is a significant market for AO games, you've again made a

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by 7Prime ( 871679 )
          Great, and watch the PC, as it's rebranded as the "porno-player of the videogame industry." That's a great idea. Next thing you know, it'll be just like over in Japan, where people avoid PC games like the plague in favor of consoles, partially because of the stigma. PC games are having trouble enough as it is without becoming universally branded "pornography".
          • Yes.

            Because nobody ever uses a PC for pornography currently.

            • Re: (Score:2)

              by 7Prime ( 871679 )
              Exactly, but everyone can hide behind the notion that the PC is essentially, a business tool. But if PC games become the new home of loads of mainstream porn and torture porn, that will change.

    • I'd like to see a retailer grow some balls, tell the ESRB to shove off, and start carrying AO games on the shelves.

      Retailers don't have to tell the ESRB to shove off in order to carry AO games. An ESRB rating of AO does not mean "cannot be sold because we at the ERSB say so". It means "contains content intended for adults only". It is 100% up to the retailer to decide whether or not they want to carry such product. Most major retailers have decided that they do not want to carry AO games as a matter o

    • I've got to agree with you, and share a thought I've been having lately

      Retailers won't sell you an AO rated game, but yet they line their shelves with "unrated" DVDs, and sell anime porn [consumerist.com]
    • 'd like to see a retailer grow some balls, tell the ESRB to shove off, and start carrying AO games on the shelves.

      Maybe the retailers have grown balls and decided they don't want to service a torture porn market in video gaming.

      Maybe it is time you grew up and began asking what real adults want to see in gaming. You might just discover that disembowelment isn't the answer.

      • they don't want to service a torture porn market in video gaming.

        What's torture porn?

        Maybe it is time you grew up and began asking what real adults want to see in gaming. You might just discover that disembowelment isn't the answer.

        It's not the job of the stores to determine what I want to see in my games. Personally, I wouldn't buy Manhunt 2 no matter what they rated it, it's just not my type of game, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't carry it for people who do want to buy it. I don't care if retailers don't carry a particular game, that's their choice, what I get mad at is when they make blanket rules about games with a particular rating. Each game should be evaluated by the store based on how well they t

        • It's not the job of the stores to determine what I want to see in my games.

          The chains are free to decide what they want to sell. Don't like it. Build your own.

        • What's torture porn?
          Saw, Hostel, Touristas... Slasher flicks with lots of blood.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by 7Prime ( 871679 )
            Not only "lots of blood," Monty Python and the Holy Grail has lots of blood, but that's satyrical. We're talking about scenes which involve a person being concious and emotional while they're disembowelled, we get off on seeing the fear in their eyes, and their blood-curtling screams. If it were just gore, autopsy films would be the thing of the day.

            Personally, I think "torture porn" is a really really scary trend in today's culture. It's basically snuff, but with the ability to justify it to yourself becau

            • Re: (Score:2)

              by LKM ( 227954 )

              It's actually a very small step to snuff films, themselves...

              I don't think so. While I find stuff like Saw and Hostel pretty disgusting, there's a world of difference between watching a special effect of someone having his eye cut off, and watching someone really having his eye cut off. I think stuff like Hostel is more on the lines of all those gore/slasher movies. Even movies like Braindead or Bad Taste or Evil Dead have horribly brutal scenes, but you really couldn't compare them to snuff. If it's not

            • Re: (Score:1)

              by AvitarX ( 172628 )
              I actually think Faces of Death and Banned from Television predated the movement by movie studios (at least in the US, can't speak to other places).

              I don't know if they count as snuff though people laughing and cheering as someone gets mushed by a train is to me more disturbung than the same for someones toe getting cut off for pretend.

              I can't recall any movies that were like that when I was in high-school, but everyone had seen part of a faces of death.

              • Re: (Score:1)

                by mink ( 266117 )
                Many years ago, when the internet was young, I remember reading a site that dubunked the "reality" of Faces of Death. Sure on almost every tape, some of the things (mostly historical/war/documentary) are true and can be verified, but most footage was found to have been faked.

            • We're talking about scenes which involve a person being concious and emotional while they're disembowelled, we get off on seeing the fear in their eyes, and their blood-curtling screams.

              Well, of course. Public executions, by disembowelment or the far nastier methods human imagination has come up over the centuries, used to be public spectacles. We aren't genetically different from ancient romans who got their kicks watching people getting torn apart by lions and getting nailed to crosses, so why are you

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by 7Prime ( 871679 )
        THANK YOU!

        As much as I hate Wal-Mart and the like, I think it took some guts to stand up to popular demand like that, and try to reverse the ever-increasing trend of "torture-porn" (as you call it... love the name, btw) in our culture. Probably the first and last time I'll ever agree with them on anything.
    • Two problems here:

      1) Unless I really misunderstand the entire system, it's not the ESRB telling retailers they can't stock the game, it's retailers deciding not to stock AO games. The ESRB system is (at the moment) voluntary; there's no legal requirements connected with it. (And no, it doesn't need to be legislated; the MPAA rating system is also voluntary and it's worked fine for decades.)

      2) It's a lot harder to license the game for the console if it receives an AO rating. I doubt Nintendo would allow it.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by LKM ( 227954 )
        BMX XXX was on all last-gen systems, but the PS2 version was more censored than the other two. Nintendo, Sony and MS have all come out and said that they do not license AO games on their systems.
    • If that was the only problem, Sony, Nintendo, MS, etc would just sell their games online. The problem is that these are the companies that don't want such games on their system. For example: Microsoft just said they wanted their system to appeal a family setting [slashdot.org] and being the first to sell an AO game would kinda go against that.
  • In in a surprising turn, a slashdot summary is unedited:

    an AO ban in the states is effectively a ban on retail sales.
    should be: an AO rating in the states is effectively a ban on retail sales.

  • Unbelievable.. (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Zekasu ( 1059298 ) on Thursday July 26, 2007 @04:59PM (#20002457)
    If anyone else played the original Condemned, you'd probably agree wtih me that it would probably be rated AO, simply for all the blood. (And probably the ending.)

    Nonetheless, I'm extremely pissed that game makers have to worry about ratings now in order to get their games on the shelves. In the past it was, "Oh, look.. That conservative group is trying to nag at our game. Ha! We're number one on the selling charts!" And then finally, those "conservative groups" get a couple of lawmakers to enforce this type of law because of some group of idiot developers who decide to put an extremely well hidden sex scene in their game.

    Just great. So while we're censoring every form of art, how about Michelangelo's statue? Someone needs to put some leaves there. Oh, is that a breast on that artwork? Better get the censor bars out.

    No matter what it is, there's always some group that complains enough that, "This shouldn't be shown, because it's just.. shouldn't." Of course, I'll also assume that their kids will group up and be smiling adults that always do the right thing, help old ladies cross the streets, turn their head away from those XXX nightclubs, and of course, never ever get angry.

    Beautiful, just beautiful. I suppose if people have a bad enough psychosis that they can't tell that Condemned has a world in which demons exist and physically manifest to cause riots apart from the real world, well.. My opinion on humanity is at a loss for words.
    • Uh, not to ruin your mouth-foaming rant, but...

      "And then finally, those "conservative groups" get a couple of lawmakers to enforce this type of law because of some group of idiot developers who decide to put an extremely well hidden sex scene in their game."

      Rather than blaming the "conservative groups" boogeyman, you might want to check which side of the aisle these lawmakers are on. Hint - there's a "D" next to most of their names.

    • Just great. So while we're censoring every form of art, how about Michelangelo's statue? Someone needs to put some leaves there. Oh, is that a breast on that artwork? Better get the censor bars out.

      From the Google [nobeliefs.com]:

      "In 2002, Attorney General John Ashcroft objected to photographers taking pictures of him in front two statues, one of which has an exposed aluminum breast (the female statue goes by the name, Spirit of Justice and also colloquially referred to as Minnie Lou) in the Justice Department building's

  • Just Make It as Violent as You Please, OK?! (Score:5, Insightful)

    by cromar ( 1103585 ) on Thursday July 26, 2007 @05:02PM (#20002481)
    ...we want people to know that this is not a real world.

    I'm getting really sick of all this pussy-footing around. Personally, I have a strong aversion to graphic, unnecessary violence, but if you are so unhinged that you can't tell the difference between reality and a game you are ALREADY off your rocker.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by 7Prime ( 871679 )
      Have you even talked with most people around you? Most people I know can't distinguish reality and fiction MOST OF THE TIME, let alone when a movie or interactive video game is trying to establish itself as being reality.

  • Who will wise up... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Zerimar ( 1124785 ) on Thursday July 26, 2007 @05:10PM (#20002583)
    ...and realize there is a huge market out there for a console that will allow AO games? Can't they just have parental lockout for games with a certain rating, just like DVR's and TV's do now? Why does the entire industry push forward this notion that video games are played primarily by children?

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by Zekasu ( 1059298 )
      ... and when will they realize that it's adults who still play video games in their mother's basements that play them?

      All lack of seriousness aside, you're right about there being a potential market for an AO console. This being said, however, the game are still banned from being sold at retailers in several states. That presents a problem, other than having to order them off of some internet site. (Even then I'm sure lawmakers will have this "loophole" in their hands and strangling it, in a strange twist o
      • It's also strange that WalMart and Target will gladly sell you an Unrated Director's Cut of a movie that will extra boobs and gore from the original R rating.

    • Re:Who will wise up... (Score:4, Informative)

      by GweeDo ( 127172 ) on Thursday July 26, 2007 @05:54PM (#20003121) Homepage
      "Can't they just have parental lockout for games with a certain rating"

      The Wii, Xbox360 and PS3 already have systems where you can lock out any ESRB rating if you don't know the passcode to play.

    • Re: (Score:1, Troll)

      by westlake ( 615356 )
      ...and realize there is a huge market out there for a console that will allow AO games?
      Why does the entire industry push forward this notion that video games are played primarily by children?

      Pornography in all its forms is fundamentally an adolescent obsession. Nintendo has proven that you don't need buckets of blood to draw adults - of all ages - into video gaming.

      • Pornography in all its forms is fundamentally an adolescent obsession. O RLY? Please give us something to support this claim. Also, I don't believe Manhunt 2 is considered pornography in the common interpretation of what pr0n is.
        • I don't believe Manhunt 2 is considered pornography in the common interpretation of what pr0n is.

          Pornograhy

          Main Entry: pornography
          Function: noun
          Etymology: Greek pornographos, adjective, writing about prostitutes, from pornE prostitute + graphein to write; akin to Greek pernanai to sell, poros journey -- more at FARE, CARVE
          1 : the depiction of erotic behavior (as in pictures or writing) intended to cause sexual excitement
          2 : material (as books or a photograph) that depicts erotic behavior and is inten

      • Please. Get off your violent pornography high horse for a second. Think about this: someone may make a game which is good on its own merits (gameplay concepts, story), but is also mind-numbingly violent. But according to you, anyone who plays this game, or wishes to, is an adolescent. You're just as stuck-up as the people who bash Nintendo for making "kiddie games". A game is either good, or bad, regardless (usually, anyways) of how violent or non-violent it is. Smart gamers recognize that, and wish to play

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by antdude ( 79039 )
      Because back in the old days, video games were mostly played by kids. Many old people don't know that. For example with my parents, they think those cartoons (e.g., South Park, Simpsons, Family Guy) are for kids. Sheesh.
    • Can't they just have parental lockout for games with a certain rating, just like DVR's and TV's do now?

      Uh, yeah. They already do, way ahead of you there. But much like the V-Chip required in every TV, it does nothing to prevent busy-bodies from trying to censor everything they don't like.
    • ...and realize there is a huge market out there for a console that will allow AO games? Can't they just have parental lockout for games with a certain rating, just like DVR's and TV's do now? Why does the entire industry push forward this notion that video games are played primarily by children?

      It is called a PC.
  • When I saw this article title, I choked up a bit.

    Hold on, my friends. With each passing day, games are being more and more scrutinized. It's only a matter of time until it's a criminal offense to make a violent game.

    And you know what the absolute worst part about all this is? The original video game generation is the generation calling the shots on this one.

    How big of a pile of bullshit is that?

    • Re: (Score:3)

      by brkello ( 642429 )
      No, I disagree. The original video game generation is around 30. Still fairly young for politics. It will take another decade or two before we are in power. And then we will be afraid of something else that the younguns are in to.
      • The average age of gamers in the US is actually 33. Surprising, but true.

      • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

        by Damvan ( 824570 )
        Dude, you are off by at least 10 years. I am 40, and definately a member of the original video game generation.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by rbanzai ( 596355 )
      I'm 40. The first arcade game I played was "Computer Space" in 1972. I've been playing video games for pretty much as long as they have existed.

      I think this whole controversy is dumb. Just like the organizations that tried to "protect" youth from slasher and nudie moves they are trying to do the same with video games.

      It has nothing to do with the "original video game generation." Some people want to control other people. Some don't. These folks obviously do, and I don't support them. //proud of his "origina

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Hatta ( 162192 )

      And you know what the absolute worst part about all this is? The original video game generation is the generation calling the shots on this one.

      How big of a pile of bullshit is that?

      About the same as the children of the 60s now leading the War on Drug Users.
  • Several posts have mentioned that the console makers have to give their ok for an AO game to be released on said platform. Does anyone know if there is any sort of work being done on an open source hardware platform kind of thing, for which AO rated games would be freely available without mfr's "upgrade kit/license"?
    • I Imagine that would be hard to do, as most companys wouldn't want to put the R&D into making a AO game on hardware that they will not be able to recoup costs on. Just because they have code, it still cost them to make it, and I think it would be extremely unlikely for them to release the code without some form on compensation. While I think there is a large market for AO games, unfortunatly nobody is willing to be seen as the "dirty" or "perverted" console to allow them. It's not good for the everyman'

    • oes anyone know if there is any sort of work being done on an open source hardware platform kind of thing

      Consoles are an interesting problem. People are hesitant to spend money on a potentially expensive device that won't have many games available for it, so you really need to have a big company behind you in order to produce a successful new console. Even with a big name backing you, the battle is still up hill, because people tend to buy only 1 or 2 consoles, so your really having to compete hard in an entrenched market. There are open source portable consoles out there (that run Linux no less), but they'r

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by grumbel ( 592662 )
      It is already there and it is called Windows. Its not OpenSource, but the SDKs are freely available and there no restriction on what you can do with it. Well, maybe a bit deep down in the EULA, but nothing that stops you from AO, you don't even need a rating in the first place.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by LKM ( 227954 )

      Several posts have mentioned that the console makers have to give their ok for an AO game to be released on said platform. Does anyone know if there is any sort of work being done on an open source hardware platform kind of thing, for which AO rated games would be freely available without mfr's "upgrade kit/license"?

      Windows, Mac, Linux, GP2X, take your pick :-)

  • Would we have doom? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by oni ( 41625 ) on Thursday July 26, 2007 @05:44PM (#20003015) Homepage
    I wonder if Doom would make the cut if it were released today.

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by PixelScuba ( 686633 )
      Hell, Doom was heavily scrutinized in 1999 for violence, being blamed for the Comumbine shootings... and it was already 6 years old then.
      • Local news STILL mention Doom every once in a while. Doom will be a scapegoat in 1000 years. Nevermind that kids today have no idea what it is.
  • Just have rainbows shoot out of someones neck when they are decapitated.
  • When movies get an X or NC-17 rating that doesn't prevent them from being sold in adult stores or in back-rooms of rental places. Why not just allow a game to get an 'AO' rating, then put them in adult retail stores or etc. and let the rating do what it is supposed to and allow the sale of the game to the proper audience just like porn... I don't mind being carded for buying an 'R' rated movie or even an 'X', so I wouldn't mind being carded to buy an 'AO' game, because I'm an adult and like to buy what I ch
    • Why not just allow a game to get an 'AO' rating, then put them in adult retail stores.

      That is where the AO rated PC games are now and always have been.

  • Has any game company with an AO product tried using an online channel to market?

    It seems like a downloadable, DVD/CD burnable version is feasible these days, given the bandwidth available to much of their target audience. Give each downloaded image a unique key to be emailed to the purchaser and entered on the console to run.
    (I'm assuming that it's possible to make recordable DVD/CDs that will run on un-modified consoles)

    Sure, the keygens will happen pretty soon, but it's not really any more problem th

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