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Industry Fallout from GTA IV Delay 109

Posted by Zonk from the crime-does-pay dept.
SET writes "MSNBC has an interesting writeup on the shakeups in the gaming industry following Take-Two's announcement that Grand Theft Auto IV has been delayed. The article examines the problems this creates for Microsoft and Sony, both of whom were expecting GTA IV to help boost Xbox 360 and Playstation 3 sales this coming holiday season. 'Analyst Michael Pachter told Web site GamesIndustry.biz that he believes Rockstar has delayed the game because it is struggling with development on the PlayStation 3. Sony denies this charge and said that the company has a dedicated team working with Rockstar on "GTA IV." They say they're not that worried about the delay and would prefer that Rockstar take the time it needs to perfect the game. "We'd love to have [it] out as soon as possible," said Sony spokesperson Dave Karakker. "But we've never had a single game make or break any of our platforms. That's not how we built 100 million sales of [the] PlayStation 2, and that's not how we'll build 100 million in sales of [the] PlayStation 3."'"
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Industry Fallout from GTA IV Delay More

Industry Fallout from GTA IV Delay

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  • The 360 will have Halo 3. The Wii will likely have Mario Galaxies and possibly even Super Smash Brothers Brawl. And the PS3 will have... what? How many crappy holiday seasons can Sony survive?
    • Not just Halo 3. For the 360, Halo 3 was just one on my list of must-buys this year. I'm actually relieved that GTA is moved back because there are too many other great games hitting the 360 around the same time. For me, I'm looking forward to Mass Effect, Ace Combat 6, Halo 3, Blacksite, and Assassin's Creed. Along with some others I'm interested in (two worlds, bioshock, etc.), but at $60 a shot, that's already $300 without GTA. PS3, on the other hand, I'd be awfully sick of Oblivion and Resistance b

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Pluvius ( 734915 )
      Lair, Heavenly Sword, and Ratchet & Clank, among other non-exclusive games that may or may not drive sales based on looking better than their 360 counterparts. Not too impressive, but the Wii's library is not all that impressive either, and the 360 has had a year's head-start.

      Rob
      • You forgot Warhawk [warhawk.com].

        To quote a recent preview [gamesradar.com]

        "The online blast we'll still be playing when Halo 3 is a distant memory" ... that would be the title, and certainly enough to be fighting words. :)
    • Fanboys will carry Sony to a mediocre PS3 life. If this generation's trends continue, they won't be around for PS4. The poor first year of this console will hurt Sony much longer than some think.
      • Agreed. The PS2s first year was poor, but it followed it up with a damn good 2nd year. And, more importantly, it essentially has zero competition during that first year. So it didn't matter that there weren't that many games, or that they were crappy -- it could actually get away with just wowing people with fancy graphics.

        By the time the other consoles had gotten past their "launch window," the PS2 was coming into its heyday.

    • Re:So, come Christams time... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by realinvalidname ( 529939 ) on Thursday August 09, 2007 @03:47PM (#20173893) Homepage

      The 360 will have Halo 3. The Wii will likely have Mario Galaxies and possibly even Super Smash Brothers Brawl. And the PS3 will have... what? How many crappy holiday seasons can Sony survive?

      I think they're banking on a couple, actually. Their stubborn resistance to permanently lower the price and their continued statements of pride (if not bombast) makes me think that they believe the Wii is a short-term thing, a fad, one whose technical limitations will cause it to hit the wall in a year or two, at which point the PS3 will become the mainstream machine, and still command a hefty price. By this thinking, the 360 isn't a concern; while the Wii is outselling the PS3 6-to-1 in Japan [360-gamer.com], it's outselling 360 by 15-to-1 (or, crunched another way, even the lowly PS3 is outselling 360 almost 3-to-1). Hopelessly irrelevant in Japan, 360 isn't the competitor, and Sony is simply counting on Nintendo to fail.

      Crummy idea? Wishful thinking? I'd say so. But that's what this behavior looks like to me.

      • And by that time, Sony will have only an old PS3 to sell, Nintendo could probably develop an HD Wii to better compete, and it'll be close to Microsoft's refresh cycle for the third Xbox anyway. Brilliant.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by F34nor ( 321515 ) *
          But all they need to do is add another cell and the PS3 will scale rapidly. Remember that now that the PS3 has hit SETI it has doubled its capacity. All the PS3 needs is for the developers to unlock it for it to move forward.

          I think you are right about the Wii HD or the Wiii as I'd call it. Minor advancement in power paid for by buckets of cash would take the Wii higher at a brisk pace.

          From what I've seen of the coming year Bioshock will own Halo3 and GTAIV. System Shock is one of the best games of all time

    • And the PS3 will have... what?

      4.5 million sales, so far.

      How many crappy holiday seasons can Sony survive?

      At the rate they're making money? Longer than their customers are likely to live.

      Microsoft's xbox division has still not managed to show a profit - ever (the first xbox lost them several billion dollars over its lifespan). It doesn't matter how much you want to label the PS3 as a failure; by any reasonable business measure ("How much money have we made?"), Sony have once again come out miles ahead of Mic

      • ft. The problem with these "market penetration" schemes is that they don't do you any good unless you can convert that penetration into profit, and Microsoft haven't yet shown any ability to do this, despite running a great many penetration schemes in a great many different markets.

        You fail to understand MS's brilliance. The XBox, Zune, etc don't need to make money, because they keep people locked into the OS, (and in the 360's case, argue for upgrading). Mostly they need to prevent other people from ach

        • P.S. I know I put a typo in surfing, but I don't believe in backtracking to fix typos.

          I have to wonder if the effort you saved in not backtracking to fix typos was greater or less than the effort to explain why you didn't want to do so.

          I'm assuming, of course, that your stance on this issue is related to the overall efficiency of the process, rather than principle, because I can't imagine what sort of principle would lead you to not backtrack to fix typos.

          On the other hand, I don't pretend to omniscience, s

      • Its interesting if you go back to a parts break-down of the PS3 and see that the BD components only add about $20 to the cost of making a PS3 IIRC. I'd like to see a comparison break-down on the 360's components and then work out how much Microsoft is losing on every console sold. Yay, so Sony loses money on initial consoles, they did with the PS2 too. But Microsoft lost money on EVERY Xbox ever sold, EVER. Microsoft could be selling you that "cheaper" 360 and losing more money per unit than Sony is. W
        • I think most people dismiss the Ps3 because they're comparing the 2nd wave of 360 games to the 1st wave of PS3 games. The PS3 hasn't been out as long as the 360, and few people acknowledge the weakness of the launch titles *cough* Madden 06 *cough*. There was a SERIOUS drought of games for the 360 for quite a while after launch (I know because I was looking for games to give me a reason to buy a 360... waited until last fall to get one), not to mention the frequency of delays for some of the flagship titl
  • If anything, the delay of GTA4 is for the best.

    This holiday market is already flooded with tons of new releases. Right now I have to make decisions on what games I want to buy. And with Guitar Hero 3 and Rock Band costing way above the average of a regular game it makes my choices harder and fewer.

    Most of the individuals I've talked to who own either a PS3 or 360 are relieved that GTA4 was delayed.
    • I think most people here are discussing what the delay means to the industry, not to their own personal buying habits. No offense, but I could care less about whether you can afford all the games you want.

  • Personally, I'm happy it's delayed (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Pojut ( 1027544 ) on Thursday August 09, 2007 @03:11PM (#20173433) Homepage
    What with all the crazy shit coming out in the next few months for the 360, PS3, and the Wii, the last thing that I needed was another game that would suck up 40-60 hours playtime...this at least gives me (and many others) a chance to play through all the stuff coming out by the end of the year.

    Take your time Rockstar. We will buy it regardless of when you release it.
    • There are a lot of comments like parent but I chose this one because it sounds the most like a complaint of having too much stuff to play.

      "Release Date" doesn't mean a whole lot to me ever since I've been working full time. I don't think I'll ever understand the need, particularly in gaming, for a 0-day experience.

      I stay off the spoiler sites, stay away from FAQs, and even with stuff slipping through the cracks I can still thoroughly enjoy a game. I mean, just two weeks ago I bought Final Fantasy XII and I'

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Pojut ( 1027544 )
        Im in the same situation as you...full time job, etc. My whole point is that I don't really have all that much time for the games that I want to actually play the entire way through...by spacing them out, it leaves less things on my "still need to play" list. Since I have become an adult, that list has grown from never having more than three to four titles at a time on it to being nearly a page long...and never getting shorter :-(
      • The problem with buying the games long after release for me is mostly with the online play. If you pick up a game long after release, most people playing have had a good head start, and will generally trash you pretty badly, which takes a bit of the fun out of it. There are also generally fewer people playing, although this generally isn't as much of a problem. Neither of these things are very serious, but they do influence me on when I buy games ... I like to buy online oriented games earlier.

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Xtravar ( 725372 )
        I think you're looking at this the wrong way. It's not the 0-day, cutting edge thing that attracts most people. It's more correlated to how much joy and excitement you derive from these games.

        I'm in the same boat as you with the whole waiting to play games... for most games. Same with most movies "I'll rent it when it's out on video."

        But let's say you're a huge Star Wars, Ghostbusters, and Transformers fan, and let's pretend all of those movies came out on the same weekend. Now, you've been anticipating
  • My thoughts about the dealy, I am frikkin livid about it.
    I was jacking a car from some muppet this morning when he told me about the delay.
    I shot the fucker right there and then.

  • Holy biased! (Score:5, Insightful)

    by ivan256 ( 17499 ) on Thursday August 09, 2007 @03:19PM (#20173531)
    So some random analyst assumes the PS3 is the problem, and it ends up in the flamebait summary even though a VP at Rockstar says they haven't figured out how to deal with the lack of hard drive in the Xbox 360 [computeran...ogames.com]?

    Why doesn't the summary mention that Microsoft is considering allowing games which require the hard drive [xboxfamily.com], possibly in response to these issues with GTA IV? Instead it just trash-talks the PS3. Lovely.
    • So some random analyst assumes the PS3 is the problem

      Actually, it's all over the media. G4 TV has been quite frank in how the PS3 delays are way longer for virtually all announced games, although they say some of that is just due to marketroids overpromising game ship dates.

    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Holy misinformation! That was one incredibly leading question. Rockstar was basically asked "is there a limit to storage space?" and the answer was, not surprisingly, yes. No one has yet to invent a device that can contain unlimited storage. (Gee, I wonder why?)

      They most certainly did NOT say that the limited space was limiting GTA4 in any way.

      Besides, Microsoft already allows games that require the hard drive. As Penny Arcade pointed out, there already is an MMORPG that requires the hard drive. (Just becau
    • I love the 360, but I don't understand why Microsoft is so opposed to allowing such games. Are there really that many people buying Core systems? What's the point?
    • talk about flaimbait, why dont u RTFM again:

      The difficulties aren't limited to working on Microsoft's box, as Houser explains that "both have enormous challenges" and that "both have their own particular pleasures and pains".

  • 100 Million (Score:5, Funny)

    by newgalactic ( 840363 ) on Thursday August 09, 2007 @03:23PM (#20173583)
    " ...That's not how we built 100 million sales of [the] PlayStation 2, and that's not how we'll build 100 million in sales of [the] PlayStation 3." If the PS3 hits 100 million in sales, I promise you Sony, I'll go out and buy two.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by rwa2 ( 4391 ) *
      Actually, it'd be interesting to see where current PS2 sales fall in with all of this. My understanding is that it's still selling pretty well, and already has a large library of top games that maximize its still respectable computing power.

      Hell, I just bought a used PS2 two weeks ago (my first console since my Famicom - the Japanese version of the original Nintendo). The complete setup was 1/10th the price of updating my PC gaming rig, and since I've virtually been living under a rock for the past few de

  • But we've never had a single game make or break any of our platforms. That's not how we built 100 million sales of [the] PlayStation 2...

    [
    [
    [
    [

    (The above space intentionally left blank: readers may insert their own jokes about PS2 failure rates)

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by kasek ( 514492 )
      i bought my ps2 on launch day, and only replaced it last year because it was just too darned big - i wanted the smaller footprint of the new ps2.

      sorry, was i supposed to put this in the form of a joke somehow?

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Damvan ( 824570 )
        Great, another "Mine works fine, therefore they all work fine" posts.

        You know, my car has never broken down. So why the hell are there so many mechanics? If my car hasn't needed repair, no other cars have needed repair either. How do those guys make a living?
  • I think Sony is wrong with the "no single game makes or breaks our platform" remark. I knew quite a few people who bought a PS2 specifically for GTA 3 and I think there are a lot of people who are specifically waiting for Metal Gear Solid 4.

    And it would not be uncommen: I mean how many people bought an Xbox specifically for Halo?
    • I agree with you. The only reason I'd even consider buying a PS3 is for MGS4. But, considering the (still) outrageous prices of the different PS3 versions, I'd rather spend my hard-earned cash on a 360 (for the record, the last gaming system I bought besides my computer was a PS2). Considering the the 360 is going to be getting both Halo 3 AND GTAIV (and I think we can also assume it will get some iteration of MGS4 eventually, just like Substance and Subsistence before it) it just makes more sense to spl
    • I purchased the PS2 a little over a year ago just for katamari 1 and 2. Once I played through these games my ps2 went into a box in my closet. The only other game I would have had any interest in playing on my ps2 was guitar hero2 I purchased that one for the 360, and have since downloaded 1 of the song packs. Soon enough the new Katamari game will be released on the 360 and possibly the wii / ps3. I plan on buying the wii when I can walk in and find it on the shelves at the stores, I have no plans as
    • Halo made the Xbox succeed, almost no doubt about it. Presumably PGR helped, but at the end of the day, I'm not convinced it would have been pretty had Halo not been bought over to Xbox from PC (from Mac).

      To suggest that the PS2 would have struggled without GTA3, is just stupid. There are a dozen headline titles that are used in the "I bought a PS2 purely to play [game]" sentence.

      Besides, your own comment supports the opposite of your point. You named _two_ games that the console is specifically purchased f
      • Okay, maybe my point did not come across well. Of course the Playstation has a lot of "system seller" games and would have probably done fine without GTA 3. But GTA 3 was unprecedented in the freedom it gave you in a 3D-World and was at the time a PS2 exclusive, as the PC and Xbox versions came much later, so it was a very compelling reason to buy a PS2 and so it was a critical title to give Sony the lead in last generations console race. And all the even more popular successors in the franchise (Vice City,
        • "Look, the only point I tried to make was that the Sony guy was wrong to say that there was never a time when a single game would be critical to the success of the Playstation."

          And what I'm telling you is that you are wrong. With regards to prior consoles, it's absolutely correct to suggest that The Playstation 1 and Playstation 2 never had a single game that was critical to their success. There simply wasn't. I'll admit that at launch it appeared as though this would be the case for Playstation3 though, al
    • Of course the single game remark is ridiculous. I bought the Xbox because my PC at the time couldn't run Morrowind. I bought the PS2 for Gran Turismo and GTA 3. Hell, the biggest reason to buy the PS1 for me was FF7. There were billboards all over L.A. with still shots from the cinematics in FF& and I didn't care how the game was or what the system was I just knew I had to play it.
    • But why? Why would you do that? Especially for the two past examples you gave... Both GTA3 and Halo were released for the PC - and the GTA series (can't speak for Halo - no played it on an XBox, but it's FPS, so the same probably applies) was far better (graphics, control system, existance of mods) on the PC. Vice City on the PC, for example, looked far better than San Andreas did on the PS2.
  • It's pretty sad, since they've yanked off a lot of the people to start work on Grand Theft Auto: Emerald City.

    Especially since this Seattle based version, with a fictional Grey's Anatomy "Seattle Grace" hospital where KOMO TV is next to the Space Tower (Space Needle), doesn't even have the Fremont Troll, although it does have an Art Car where the Fremont Troll should be.

    Personally, I'd love to play it, but it sounds like I'll have to wait for the Mac version, cause it requires Windows Vista, that or wait fo
  • Comment removed based on user account deletion

    • The same people who gave you "Crackdown" for the XBox360 (Realtime Worlds) are working on a MMO called (last time I checked) APB.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by British ( 51765 )
      It exists in unoffical forms, called GTA:MP. It is HORRIBLY buggy. The "los santos role play" is amazingly boring and takes the fun out of GTA with speeding tickets, red tape, etc.
    • Well ... FinalFantasy XI was released on the PS2, and then ported to the XBox360.

      The people who brought you Crackdown are working on a MMORPG for the XBox 360.

      Sony also announced a whole bunch as being "in development", ("Endless Saga" from Webzen, an untitled MMORPG from Square Enix (rumored to be a new version of FFXI), a DC Comics based MMORPG (hopefully targeting PCs and PS3s), "The World" (from Namco/Bandai based on .Hack)). The only MMORPG that we've seen anything about though has been "The Agency" [sony.com].

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by rwa2 ( 4391 ) *
      Well, there's the Multi Theft Auto mod:
      http://mtavc.com/ [mtavc.com]

      Haven't tried it, though. All my friends are too busy leveling up in WoW and EVE to engage in any simple human skill-based game.
  • "But we've never had a single game make or break any of our platforms. That's not how we built 100 million sales of [the] PlayStation 2" GTA3 was the saviour of the PS2, anyone with hardware sales figures and calander can show you that.
  • The only way they'll make 100 million sales of the PS3 is if they give it away....

  • But we've never had a single game make or break any of our platforms. No sir, to successfully break a platform takes a concerted effort involving acute arrogance from each and ever one of our divisions combining unwarranted proprietary format rollout, overly expensive product pricing, and the destruction of customer trust through a history of anti-consumer attitudes and unscrupulous use of the latest in invasive DRM technologies. Look, we know what we're doing here.

    Oh I kid Sony. I kid.

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